Of course the Cincinnati Reds need the minor leagues. What a stupid question. And really, I’m sorry to have written it as the headline. But it’s ripping off the headline from an article that ran yesterday at Five Thirty Eight titled “Do we even need Minor League Baseball?”. The headline, of course, is incredibly misleading. At no point within the article does it suggest that Minor League Baseball should be eliminated. I don’t blame Travis Sawchik, the author of the article for the headline – authors rarely get to write the headline…. but whoever was in charge made it awfully clickbaity.

Some of the article’s focus is on how training, rather than playing in games, is what can and will lead to improvement today. The idea is that with the technology we have today, versus a decade or more ago, that the games simply don’t provide the best “learning” environment. High speed cameras, ball tracking, bat tracking, mechanic tracking – these things allow quick diagnosis of what one is doing right or wrong, immediately, and allow coaches and players to make adjustments today simply by looking at the video and data.

We’ve seen players and coaches speak directly of this, too. Being able to have the video of a pitcher releasing the ball can show why a pitch is doing what it’s doing. Or why it’s not doing what the pitcher wants to do. When you can shoot video at 3000 frames per second instead of the 24 to 30 frames per second that the camera’s have been shooting video footage at for 75 years, it allows you to get very detailed at exactly what’s happening. Being able to show that and explain it makes a huge difference.

Much of the early part of the article focuses on the Houston Astros. They have been doing things a bit differently for a while now. As noted in the Five Thirty Eight article, while some teams just now are getting into using high speed cameras (Edgertronic cameras), the Astros have been using them for years and even in the 2018 season had them in their farm system at every level, at multiple angles, to help them scout, develop, and coach.

Of course, there’s also the side of things where you need to actually play the game in order to learn. The situations matter. The guy at the other end trying to beat you matters. Whether that’s the opposing pitcher and catcher learning to attack hitters, or the pitcher learning to trust his stuff, or whether it’s the hitter learning to read pitchers or see a slider instead of a fastball – that’s stuff you aren’t going to be getting from the tech.

One interesting thing, and this gets a bit closer to the point of the headline of the article, is that the Astros eliminated two teams from their farm system chain. They currently have seven teams in their farm system. They have one team in the Dominican Summer League. And there’s one team at the complex level in the Gulf Coast League. They also have a short-season team in the New York-Penn League. And then there’s the four full-season affiliates. In 2017 they had two teams in the Dominican Summer League, and an additional team in the Appalachian League.

The Reds were the beneficiaries of the Astros dropping their Appalachian League team. Cincinnati bought the franchise and they became the Greeneville Reds. That, however, didn’t add a team to the organization. The Reds in turn eliminated one of their Dominican Summer League teams. When this happened one of the stated reasons was that with more limited resources – particularly in the Dominican Republic – (I’m paraphrasing here) there could be more focus and teaching with a smaller group rather than when there were two teams and twice as many players.

Not every team, at least right now, is looking at the “smaller is better” philosophy, though. The New York Yankees, who are viewed as a more forward thinking team around baseball, have nine teams. Of course, as recently as 2016 they had 10 teams, but like the Reds they have dropped down to just one Dominican Summer League team.

There’s some logic to both ideas. The fewer teams the more you can try to devote your focus to a smaller group of players and in theory, get more out of that situation. On the other side of the coin, the more players you can have under contract, the more chances you have for players to develop into Major Leaguers.

Current Major Leaguer Walker Buehler had this quote within the article, and I think it’s something that should be discussed.

At any affiliate, there are three players who have a chance to play in the majors. The rest of the players are there so they so they can play. I don’t think that’s fair,” Buehler told FiveThirtyEight. “You are preying on their dreams.

It’s definitely something I have heard from a whole lot of people over the years. Now, if the idea is that there’s three guys on a team that might be every day guys in the Major Leagues, there’s probably some truth to that. But the idea that only three guys on a team are ever going to be Major Leaguers doesn’t hold much water – at least once you reach A-ball.

The Dayton Dragons are in their 20th year of existence. They began playing in 2000 and they have had 102 players reach the Major Leagues. That’s an average of 5 players for team. But that number isn’t exactly accurate, either. The 2019 team obviously didn’t have a Major Leaguer on it (other than a rehabbing Kyle Farmer). The 2018 team hasn’t turned out a Major Leaguer yet, either. The 2017 team has one thus far – reliever Joel Kuhnel. That 2017 team had Taylor Trammell, Jose Siri, Tyler Stephenson, TJ Friedl, Scott Moss, Tony Santillan, Ryan Hendrix, and Dauri Moreta on it. There’s a pretty good chance that team’s going to wind up with a lot more than 5 future Major Leaguers on it.

Sometimes you simply don’t know who’s truly going to be a Major Leaguer. Ryan Hanigan went undrafted through 50 rounds and spent parts of 11 seasons in the Major Leagues. Brien Taylor was the #1 overall pick in the draft and didn’t spend 1 day there. Sometimes it’s the been the utility guy in Triple-A that somehow turned that role into the same one in the Major Leagues for a decade.

And finally, there’s the whole thing where Minor League Baseball helps grow the game itself. And for Major League Baseball, that’s something that they have been trying to focus on with a younger crowd for a long time now. For those of us who live in Cincinnati or Dayton, getting to a Major League game is easy. For those of you who live in Billings, Montana the closest team to you is the Colorado Rockies, a mere 520 miles away.

Minor League games are far more “family friendly”. First, the games are a lot cheaper. Second, the entertainment options are far better for children. Nearly all minor league teams do between-innings entertainment. Whether that’s something on the field, or on top of the dugouts, there’s good fan interaction. It’s not just something on the video board or a t-shirt cannon like you’ll get in the Major Leagues.

All of those words to say that, yes, we need the minor leagues. There’s an argument that maybe teams would be ok in terms of development with fewer teams in the minor leagues. But there’s also one that says they wouldn’t be. The article has some interesting things within it, so you should read it. But it misses a whole lot of what Minor League Baseball does, too.

Oh yeah, I’m selfish and Minor League Baseball helps pay my bills by existing.

16 Responses

  1. Cguy

    I didn’t get to watch a lot of Reds TV broadcasts then. But I had a transistor radio on my nightstand, & Wahtye(sp) Hoyt put me to sleep many evenings when I was young.

    • MikeinSoCal

      I remember Waite Hoyt on the radio. Like most broadcasters of those days he was a great story teller. Was a team mate of Babe Ruth. It was great growing up listening to Reds baseball on the radio. Wally Post, Gus Bell, Smoky Burgess. Fun baseball times.

      • Oldtimer

        Example of Waite Hoyt broadcasting:

        Reds trail by 3 runs in 9th inning. Cleanup hitter F Robby up with bases loaded. Count is 3-2. Cut to Waite:

        “And there’s a LONG drive DEEP to RF. Back, back, and … the game is over!” Go to commercial …

        Only then would you find out if it was Grand Slam HR or fly out to RF.

        My favorite Hoyt broadcast was Jim Maloney’s no-hitter that went into 11th inning in 1965. He was itching to say No-Hitter but wouldn’t do it. Instead he would History Is Being Made Here Tonight … over and over.

  2. Norwood Nate

    Well stated and good insights. Agree we need the minor leagues.

  3. Haven

    The only question I’ve ever wondered about the minors is do we really need as many teams as we have?

    The reds have 7ish teams off the top of my head, with the percent of guys who actually make it just seems kind of silly.

  4. Tv

    Saber is the curse of baseball. Longer games with no action. Tons of ridiculous stats based on a mathematicians guessing what numbers he wants to use. All power no hit. Hard hit balls that go to a 2ed basemen in the middle of 1st and 2ed. Teams will use whatever they think gives them an edge until mlb does something about it. Now doug is trying to say the article did not say what it did. Saber is like a cult for guys that don’t watch games and tweet the entire time.

    • Doug Gray

      The curse of baseball is that pitchers are too good. It’s not “saber”. It’s the fact that pitchers are insanely talented today. Trust me the “saber” guys watch more baseball than anyone.

    • Big Ed

      “Teams will use whatever they think gives them an edge . . .”

      Uh, yeah. Just like they’ve been doing since the Cap Anson era.

  5. Cguy

    Maybe my memory is skewed, but I do not remember Pete Rose looking at a called 3rd strike with runner(s) in scoring position & less than 2 outs. I thought it was the prerogative of the pitcher to extend the strike zone slightly, & the obligation of the hitter to execute. At that time, I thought THAT was the game of baseball– now, not so much.

  6. James K

    Maybe the question should be, do we need Major League Baseball? I think minor league is more fun.

  7. Rick Welsh


    your Redleg Nation site has not been updated for days, at least when I log on. Am I doing something wrong?


  8. Big Ed

    There is no doubt that today’s game has far more power pitching, particularly in relief. If you want a good laugh, look at the strikeout rates of the mid-70s Reds relievers.

    The Big Red Machine era did include a lot of guys who threw hard enough, with excellent command. Seaver, Gibson, Jenkins, Sutton, Carlton, etc. There were some legitimate power pitchers in the 1970s, too, such as Nolan Ryan and J.R. Richard. The softer ball, with higher seams, made it more difficult to hit home runs, and thus did not reward the kinds of swings we see today, which in turn rewarded pitchers with excellent command who could induce soft contact.

    The power pitching game is the result of bigger guys getting better coaching, but I do not find that today’s 3-true-outcome game to be as entertaining or as interesting as the more finessed MLB of a generation ago.

    The rubber on the mound is 60.5 feet, or just more than 3 feet short of the exact distance between home and second base (which 63.63 inches). I think that they need to study moving the rubber back about 18 inches, to restore some finesse to the game. There isn’t really anything sacrosanct or even symmetrical about 60′ 6″.

    And they need to fix the ball. The AAA home run rate was up more than 55% in the first season using the MLB ball, which tells you all you need to know about the baseball itself.