The rumor of choice today in the Cincinnati Reds world is the one that involves Cleveland Indians 4-time All-Star shortstop Francisco Lindor. It was reported this morning by Mark Feinsand of MLB.com that the Reds are the latest team to engage with Cleveland about trade talks for the infielder.

Jon Heyman of MLB Network chimed in about 90-minutes later that the Indians are said to like Nick Senzel very much. He noted that he hadn’t heard of much talk between the two teams, though.

The Reds, in a trade that would bring in Francisco Lindor, would certain be yet another signal that they are going for it in 2020. When they traded with Cleveland and San Diego last July to acquire Trevor Bauer, who is a free agent after the 2020 season, it was the first signal that they were indeed pushing their chips forward. That begs the question, though, would they trade their starting center fielder who has six years of team control remaining, and is a former top 10 prospect as recently as May of 2019, in a deal for two years of an MVP caliber player?

That’s a much tougher question to answer than “should the Reds trade from the future for the now”, because Nick Senzel is a part of the now. He didn’t burst onto the scene and tear the league apart, but he was roughly a league average player as a rookie while playing a position on the field that was brand new to him – and there were long stretches where he was an above-average hitter. In the final 25 games of the season he hit just .160/.241/.293, which drug down his season line quite a bit. Prior to that, in the first 79 games of the year he was hitting better than the league average, posting a line of .280/.334/.460. One has to wonder how long the shoulder had been bother him before the injury ended his season after the first week of September.

There’s not been much out there about what kind of package it would take to acquire Francisco Lindor. Rumors with the Dodgers indicated it would probably require their top prospect Gavin Lux. The 21-year-old destroyed the minors in 2019, hitting .347/.421/.607 between Double-A and Triple-A this season. In 49 games in Triple-A he hit .392/.478/.719. The Dodgers called him up in September where he hit .240/.305/.400 in 23 games.

Lux, at least according to Baseball America, is rated as the 6th best prospect in baseball right now. Nick Senzel was rated similarly when the year began. Of course, 2019 was played, and Senzel is recovering from shoulder surgery. There’s also the difference in the positions that they play. Senzel can play third, second, or in the outfield. Lux, however, can play shortstop. He could be a direct replacement for Lindor, while Senzel wouldn’t fill that specific need for Cleveland.

The Dodgers haven’t taken the deal, presumably because they believe that Gavin Lux is too much to give up in the deal. Or maybe the rumors aren’t true at all. But let’s assume for a minute that they are. If Lux is too much to give up, does that mean that Nick Senzel is, too?

Your mileage may vary on that answer. And I’ll leave it up to you to decide. But let’s keep traveling down this hypothetical road and say that yes, the Reds think that Senzel is too much to give up because going for it requires a center fielder and he’s the only one they have that they are comfortable with playing every day – even if they get Lindor.

That probably means that Cincinnati would have to try and build a trade package around top prospects, and maybe some Major Leaguers. There’s an interesting website tool to play around with when it comes to trades over at Baseball Trade Value Simulator. The details aren’t entirely spelled out as to how they come up with their trade values, but they do give a little insight into the stuff they use. It’s certainly not going to be perfect – what is? – but playing around with it gives you some idea of what it might take to get a deal accomplished.

Going through the farm system and the Major League roster, here’s what they list as the “value” for the following players:

Player Value
Nick Senzel 68
Jonathan India 30
Jesse Winker 28
Tyler Mahle 24
Nick Lodolo 21
Tyler Stephenson 21
Amir Garrett 19
Hunter Greene 18

You can take that for what you will, and disagree if you want to on some of them (I certainly do). But they also list Francisco Lindor’s value at 63.4. Based on their valuations, a swap of Lindor for Senzel straight up would slightly favor Cleveland. But assuming that the Reds aren’t willing to do that, that’s where things get a bit more interesting in what kind of package that Cincinnati may have to try to put together to get a deal done.

Any three players on the list for the Reds, not including Nick Senzel, would make the “math” work on a deal for Francisco Lindor. Of course, we can’t just do it like that because that’s not how things work in the real world. Team needs matter, too. And they matter on both sides of the equation.

Would the Indians accept a package of Nick Lodolo, Tyler Mahle, and Jesse Winker? What about one of Jonathan India, Tyler Mahle, and Amir Garrett? Would they be interested in Tyler Stephenson, Jesse Winker, and Jonathan India?

As noted, the simulator is just that – a simulator. The exact formula they use isn’t out there, and while it seems like it could spit out some realistic options, I’ve seen trades that it says are acceptable that simply can’t jive with reality, too. If the Reds are going to play in the Francisco Lindor sweepstakes it’s going to take some real talent. Maybe it all comes from the farm system. Perhaps there’s a mix of prospects and Major Leaguers. But it’s probably going to be expensive.

101 Responses

      • Datdudejs

        Because india has performed poorly in the minors and Winker has proven he is a very good hitter against major league hitters and still has plenty of control and is inexpensive

      • Dawson

        How has India performed poorly? I can’t say he’s been great, but he hasn’t been poor. His OBP has remained pretty good, which is a good sign in my opinion. Let a guy develop. Sometimes it takes a guy awhile to adjust to professional pitching. Not everyone can be Bregman, Acuna, Soto, etc.

    • Doug Gray

      As I said, I don’t agree with all of their values – but I also don’t think it’s outrageous to think some teams would value India more than Winker because of defense, position, and control.

      • Richard Thompson

        Doug,

        This would be my best off for Lindor – Castillo or Greene (Indians choice), India, and Galvis

  1. Jackson

    India, Mahle and Santillan works on the trade machine, I’d have no problem with that deal.

    • Norwood Nate

      If I were the Reds, I’d do that deal with a quickness, which means it’s probably one the Indians rebuff.

      • Bil

        Great thought, David. It would take the trade and a willingness on Lindor’s part to negotiate an extension and forgo free agency. The length of the contract gives Lindor a lot of security…and the Reds alot of confidence in his future production and his ability to remain healthy.
        If Cleveland makes the trade and Lindor would make the deal (why wouldn’t he – he becomes a very wealthy man and certainly doesn’t expect to make more $ later in his career), I would the deal.

  2. Jim

    Senzel stays.
    Greene, Stephson, Lodolo and Garcia off limits.
    Galvis, Santillian and India. 2 of our top 7 and maybe a fringe top 10-15. Maybe Sanai the low A cf.

  3. Eric

    I would start with India,Santillan, Galvis and Ervin. Not cheap by any stretch but would leave us with truly valuable prospects that we are going to need in the next year or two.

      • MuddyCleats

        Tend 2 agree. Senzel has issues imo: injuries, position uncertainty which has led to more injuries & vertigo which isn’t going away. Like his moxie, but he did struggle AB down the stretch which makes me wonder if his bat is as good as they hoped for?

    • Bill

      Not sure there’s an opportunity to “start with” anything but the Reds best offer. That’s why I would not go with Jim’s “Senzel stays” approach.
      My position is based on two basic assumptions. First, I really want this opportunity for the Reds. Second, I believe that the all star SS is more valuable than the OF prospect. I still consider Senzel a prospect…a pretty good one, but a prospect, as he only has a part of one MLB season. I assume the SS will make more plays than any single outfielder.
      The Indians have reportedly “liked Senzel alot” and I have no indication that they like anyone else and as I said, I want this deal for the Reds. With Lindor the Reds are immediately in reach of being a top tier team.

  4. DocProc

    I think Galvis would likely be part of the package because Cleveland would need a SS. In fact, I find myself wondering if the Reds picked up Galvis and his contract just so they would have SS trade compensation for a deal like this.

    • Doug Gray

      Strangely enough, when talking about the deal all day, I brought up Galvis going to Cleveland. Then I write this article and don’t mention him because I’m a big dummy.

      • Chris

        LOL. Doug, this is a very good article though, and quite interesting. I personally am amazed at the value for India. Maybe I’m jaded, but I just don’t see a whole lot in that kid that excites me, so I tend to assume other teams would feel the same way. I’m probably wrong. As for Galvis, I can’t imagine the Indians would want him due to the size of his contract. That said, I think that is our biggest problem in discussing this trade. We don’t have a SS to go the other way, that the Indians would have interest in, and would need.

      • MK

        Bill I would, Cleveland wouldn’t. I’d go Senzel, India, and Hendrix. This is similar to what they gave up for Latos and Lindor is better.

      • earmbrister

        Bill and MK. I wouldn’t trade Senzel straight up for Lindor. Five years of control of a high upside starting CF for two years of a stud SS is just a bit too much of an overpay. And who’s playing CF for the Reds going forward? A Japanese player who may not even be able to cover CF anymore in his native land? And that’s assuming you can land him.

        As for the Latos deal, that deal was for FOUR YEARS of control of a quality starting pitcher. The Reds arguably overpaid, but they were desperate to finally get some starting pitching. Four years is a wholly different universe than two years of control.

      • MK

        In actuality for all of the control they got two good and one bad year out of Latos before trading him. Senzel is a player with nice control who is a guy who has not proven yet that he can stand up to the physical rigors of a whole season, India has no position now or in the near future to play ion big league Reds. If you can get two years out of arguably the best shortstop in baseball then you have to do it. And like Latos, who knows what might be after two years.

    • Bill

      I agree DocPro. The Reds package must include Freddie Galvis and Nick Senzel. In addition, I would include either Winker, Van Meter, or a 6-10 prospect based on Cleveland’s need. Others may not include the extra player.

  5. Colt Holt

    With the new pitching development team in place, I wouldn’t give up any of the highest upside pitchers in any deal. If you have the team in place to develop, you give them the resources. With that in mind, Lodolo, Greene, Santillan all off limits.

    I would start with India, Mahle, and Galvis. Upgrade of Lindor v Galvis is much higher than Mahle v 7th starter. Given the minimal sacrifice, I would happily give up another piece with decent value.

    India, Mahle, Galvis and one of Ervin, Fairchild, Siri, or Hinds.

    • Norwood Nate

      It’s interesting to me that you do not consider Mahle to be a pitcher with high upside. He is a former top 100 prospect in all of ML. He’s had some success at the ML, as well as some struggles. He’s young still young at 25 and at times flat out dominated the minor leagues on the way up. Compared to Santillan, who is a few years younger (will be 23 in April) but also he’s a guy who at best has been a fringe top 100 prospect and struggled through his second go-round in AA (and yes, injuries likely played a part).

      I’d view them as pretty similar value and upside, with more of an established floor for Mahle. If the Indians wanted Santillan over Mahle I wouldn’t bat an eye over it.

      • Colt Holt

        I was thinking more of raw talent where the team has a couple years to develop them before they arrive on the scene. If it takes two years for mahle to arrive, he has what, three years of control left? If it takes three years for lodolo, he comes up for six.

    • KyWilson1

      This is a trade I would be ok with. India is blocked, Mahle is the 6th or 7th rotation guy, and the loss of any of the 4 of Ervin, Fairchild, Siri, Hinds isn’t going to hurt the Reds. If the Indians would take this, do it yesterday.

  6. Jon Ryker

    If Cleveland is foolish enough to trade Lindor for Senzel, then do it right now. Trade what you have to. Get Lindor.

    • Bill

      I could not agree more! Hello, Reds are looking to cotend. Winning the Lindor sweepstakes is foundational to that happening. Add Galvis to address Indians need for a SS.

  7. Wes

    Senzel offers more value to reds this year then he could ever in trade value. i think I’m dumber reading all these comments from both sites and media. Why in the world would Cleveland want senzel for the sake of having a future second basemen when it’s the deepest position by a mile in all of baseball ?!? He’s also injury prone and has vertigo. He’s the last guy I’d imagine wanting as a centerpiece of a trade.

    Then enter the Dodgers and padres. Two of the deepest systems in terms of prospects and young mlb talent. Both teams can offer a plethora of talent to obtain Lindor. So to think you are going to get him for senzel and india is a cruel jape. It will actually cost talent that will hurt to depart with.

    Nothing lighter than TySteve García mahle and Aquino. 4 players w high ceilings for an elite shortstop. Doubt dodgers or padres can do much better than that.

    • Doug Gray

      I mean there’s a report out there that the Indians really like Senzel…. so that’s why they’d want him.

      • Tv

        The reports are always wrong. Why would we trade our only center fielder in the system? Not like there are any decent free agents. Even if you get ozona you cant afford him amd lindor

      • Bill

        Great article Doug. The research you provided allows us to put some substance into an offer. I appreciate your work. Thanks!

  8. Haven

    As a younger fan I just want the reds to win. I’m so tired of waiting for a savior to come out of the minors, I say do whatever I took to get Lindor. The city is ready the pitching staff is ready, you got moose and Miley let’s bring it home. I’d give them three of whoever they wanted best case you resign lindor he’s the face of the reds, worst case you have a great season and reenergize a fan base.

  9. kyblu50

    I would want to up grade on an extension with 20 per yr for 4 yrs.

    • Colt Holt

      If Lindor would sign an extension of $20 million per for TWELVE years, he would already be an Indian for life. Word was the Indians offered him over $200 million a couple years back. Lindor is going to free agency and will get more than $300 million when he does.

      • Colt Holt

        Sorry. Make that $100 million. Terms weren’t known, but he had something like five years of team control at the time.

    • Matt T

      I like this idea. If I was Dick giving up nearly six years of control of Senzel, I’d want Lindor for longer than 2 years.

  10. Hoyce

    For lindor to sign an extension it’ll cost $40 million a year.

    • Bill

      Could the Reds buy 4 years @ $40k/yr and extend him immediately, should the Indians agree to trade him? Do Reds fans really believe that keeping Senzel is a better deal than 4 yrs of Lindor?

  11. Hoyce

    Indians are reportedly asking for final offers for lindor so they can make a decision over the weekend. Hopefully we will finally get an answer. I will personally be disappointed if lindor gets traded and it’s not to the reds

    • Colt Holt

      I will withhold judgment. I recall a trade for Eric beaded that I am glad didn’t go through!

    • Norwood Nate

      Agree. The Reds have the pieces to do it. Let’s see if they’re serious about truly trying to compete in the near future. They kicked the tires on Yelich, and may have even been a bit more serious about JTR. Both those guys would have made huge impacts, the type of impact we should expect from Lindor. At the end of the day they did not make a move, even though they had similar trade packages at their disposal. Maybe it was still a bit too early for the Reds to push their chips in. It’s not early anymore. It’s time.
      I love our prospects as much as the next guy around here, and it would be difficult to part with guys like Stephenson or Lodolo. But Lindor is next level. I want to see the Reds get to that next level now. Not putting hopes into prospects that bust as much as they boom.

      • Bill

        Well said, Nate! You gotta believe the Reds FO are in. Two years ago, I wouldn’t have believed, even if I wanted to. Now, I believe they won’t leave us hanging.
        Can’t wait for ST.

  12. Tv

    This makes no sense. If you can’t get it done with prospects dont do it. Trading winker or senzel only leaves another hole and even less money to fill it. Who would you play in center? No free agents. No one form the farm. So ya it would make u better at as but absolutely terrible in center. Not like gavis is that bad to begin with. Sure if u can trade green india gavis and one more guy not a cather or pitcher then yes. If not why max out payroll and dump the farm for a small overall improvement.

    • Bill

      I think you’re exaggerating in saying the Reds would be “absolutely terrible in center”. Even if you had to play Jankowski in center, it’s better with an all star SS.

      • Norwood Nate

        Agreed Bill. I’m not even a Jankowski fan, but if the swap in the lineup ends up Lindor and Jankowski for Galvis and Senzel then it’s still a net positive.

        Steamer projections for 2020:
        Lindor – 124 wRC+ 5.9 fWAR
        Galvis – 71 wRC+ 0.2 fWAR
        Senzel – 93 wRC+ 1.4 fWAR
        Jankowski – 69 wRC+ -0.2 fWAR

        But I think the Reds could find a better CF option. Inciarte seems obtainable from the Braves, Steamer projects him for 87 wRC+ and 1.4 fWAR. Kevin Pillar is projected for 88 wRC+ and 1.4 fWAR and is a FA. JBJ is projected 93 wRC+ and 2 fWAR and could probably be had for the salary relief alone. IMO, more CF options than SS options. No CF options that offer the upgrade Lindor offers.

  13. Tom

    Winker and Senzel and call it a day. Neither stays healthy. Lindor is a HOF talent. Would be shocked if that were all it took.

    • Bill

      Agree, Tom
      Without this deal the Reds FO must still find a hitter and address the OF deficiencies and upgrade SS to legitimately compete.

    • Craig

      Why would you trade two players from two positions of need to address another position of need? Trading Winker and Senzel leaves you with holes in LF and CF. You ready to roll with an outfield of Ervin, Janikowski/Lorenzen and Aquino? Not me.

      While I see the arguments both ways, I am not completely sold on six years of Senzel (the guy who the rebuild was partly founded upon) straight up for two years Lindor. Understanding that fantasy trade proposals are likely exercises in futility, I would think that trading redundant assets (I hesitate to use that word when talking about people) like Mahle, India, Greene and Galvis puts you squarely in the conversation. If not for Lindor, then certainly for someone like Correa or Seager. 3 current or former top 100 prospects in positions of surplus AND a big league replacement is enough IMO.

      • Eric

        The answer in that situation is to up the offer to include Mercado coming back. If it took Senzel, Santillan and Galvis to get Lindor then you send Winker and Siri for Mercado.

      • Matt T

        Winker isn’t a good defender in the OF either. The Reds can still sign Ozuna, Dickerson, or Castellanos to cover one of the corner spots. Ervin has CF experience in the minors. I understand some people want an outstanding outfield, but all you really need is passable if your offense and pitching is potent enough.

    • Michael E

      I agree too…tired of waiting on both Senzel and Winker. I think the Reds need to trade them BEFORE their value keeps going down.

      I don’t trade Lodolo or Greene, no way, not with the new pitching coaching and strategy starting up. Those guys both have top of rotation potential and Ace makings. Ty Steph is also off limits barring an offer too good to pass up.

      I have NO issue parting with Senzel, Winker, Ervin, Mahle, Garrett or several others. Not sure about Santillan.

  14. Hanawi

    India, Winker, and one of Mahle or Santillan depending on if the Indians value readiness or more control. Throw in Siri too, if they want. Think that would be a good mix of upside and ready talent now.

    2 years of control is not enough to part with any of the top 4 prospects in my opinion.

      • jay johnson

        they are loaded with mediocre outfielders already
        they want infield mlb ready and prospects.
        They love senzel for 2nd base.
        pull a sonny grey and extend lindor(dream) and throw in any minor leaguer except the 2 pitchers and Stephenson.Garcia can be part of the trade now since we have lindor.
        Worry about centerfield later.We would be getting a future hall of famer .Who was the last one of those?
        Go get the guy.PERIOD

  15. Barry

    Tom, you never know. I thought the Indians would have received way more than what they got for Kluber.

    • Bill

      That’s a great point, Barry. Hopefully, Senzel and Galvis would get it done. It gives Cleveland fair value for Lindor by the metric system. It gives them the player they’re known to value, not someone we think they should value. And it gives them a player for SS to allow them to compete this season, while they assess the landscape going forward.

  16. Reddawg12

    Trade Senzel, India, Mahle, and one of Winker or Aquino (they choose) for Lindor.
    Throw in a lower level prospect if needed. Lindor is a stud and the Indians will want a boat load of talent.

    Then sign Shogo Akiyama to play CF and Chris Dickerson or Marcel Ozuna (depending on the contract he demands) to play LF. Call it an off-season and go win the NL Central. Seems so simple.

    • Bill

      I ? you, Reddawg12! You could talk me into adding a player or two to Senzel and Galvis to “getter done, son”. I prefer Dickerson to Ozuna. Have you checked on a RFer for the Orioles Trey Mancini. Trading for Trey would give an OF of Dickerson, LF, Akiyama, CF and Mancini, RF. Add in the catching duo of Barnhart/Casali and an IF of Votto, Moustakis, Lindor and Suarez. That’ll play all day long.

  17. GhostRunner

    I’m like everyone else, there are certain players I want to keep. But having Lindor for 2 years would be exciting, draw more fans, and give the Reds a better chance at winning the division, and maybe more. My gut feeling is, Lindor plays for Cleveland this year though.

  18. Norwood Nate

    If you can get Lindor you go get Lindor. He compiled 12.6 bWAR over the past two years and he’s 26 entering his prime and he plays a position in need of upgrading with few other upgrades available (and you’d have to pay for those too). If Lindor comes close to replicating what he’s done the past two seasons over the course of the next two seasons, then it would be hard to match that value with any prospects. India, Garcia, or Stephenson would have to average a bit over 2 WAR over their six seasons of control to match what Lindor likely brings in value for the two he’d be in Cincinnati. There was exactly one Reds position player to surpass 2 WAR (Suarez…Votto was next with 1.6). Lindor is more of a sure thing, prospects stall or never make good on their potential all the time. The competitive window is open now. In two years, when we could reasonably expect those position player prospects to be able to contribute full time, who knows where we’ll be.
    It’s time for the Reds to poop or get off the pot.

  19. rgslone

    Cleveland may like Senzel – and why wouldn’t they? Senzel is versatile, and if he can hit at the MLB level he should be a nice player. But Cleveland isn’t trading a talent like Lindor for just Senzel. Senzel has not shown anything to suggest that he is in Lindor’s class. So, Cleveland is going to want a lot more; and that’s the rub.

    • Scott C

      According to the Baseball Trade Values that Doug posted, and he said he didn’t know how the numbers were put together, then Senzel would be a little better than of equal value than Lindor. Of course, Cleveland would like as good a deal for Lindor as possible. This is a seller’s market, at least in as far as Lindor is concerned. I heard this morning that Cleveland has asked for teams to put in their best offers by this weekend. If that is true then if the Reds are serious they need to make the best trade possible and will need to overpay. How serious are they about not only contending but winning the division and going to a WS.

      • Oldtimer

        Seniel had a decent rookie year and is injury prone. Lindor is the best SS in MLB.

        They do not have equal trade value.

      • Scott C

        I am not saying that, I was referring to the Baseball Trade Value Simulator. that Doug referenced in the article. I have no idea how that is determined or even the validity but I am sure that GMs have someway to determine that.

      • Oldtimer

        The emphasis nowadays is all on numbers but the Smell Test tells you that the best SS in MLB (LIndor) has a greater value than a good (not great) rookie prospect who is injury prone (Senzel).

        My guess is the Reds would have to offer an MLB starter (Senzel), a top P prospect (Lodolo or Greene), and another top prospect (such as India) to get Lindor.

        To get Joe Morgan in 1971, the Reds had to give up their best power hitter (Lee May) and All-Star 2B (Tommy Helms). You can’t trade ashes for coal (Bob Howsam quote).

      • doofus

        Rendon was injured his first couple of seasons. Is he injury prone now?

        I do not believe that teams perceive Senzel to be injury prone.

      • Michael E

        A bit of Lindor’s value is taken down (not much, but still) due to higher future costs via arbitration. If he were a rookie making minimum, then yeah, we’d have to trade 3 top 5 prospects and an solid MLB player or two.

        Given his cost is going to escalate, it shouldn’t take quite that much. Still would take a good package, but not 3 top 5 prospects. More like 2 top 5 and one around #11 or so…and maybe a solid/decent MLB player (a Winker or Ervin or Galvis or whomever).

  20. Krozley

    It won’t happen, but the player I’d trade is Suarez and a lesser prospect or two. I think the tribe would consider having a controllable power bat like Geno in a Lindor swap in lieu of a prospect package. Moose plays 3B with 2B being a blend of Senzel, Galvis, & Vanmeter. Also swing a trade for Pederson from the Dodgers to play RF and share CF with Nick. It would give quite the positional flexibility with a stronger lineup and bench, plus they keep their best prospects and can afford to add the OF power bat and maybe bullpen help.

    • Martino

      Give up Suarez? Heaven help us.. He makes a 3rd of Rendon’s salary now and Rendon is NOT 3 times better by any standard.. No…Keep Suarez or just go down swinging..

  21. Martino

    The Reds have outfielders in the minors who just aren’t particularly ready to hit ML pitching (or AAA for that matter), but can play pretty stellar defense. Senzel, while I love the kid still feels like an accident waiting to happen or as some might say, a solution looking for a problem.
    This whole thing feels like someone, no matter what is going to be between a rock and a hard place somewhere along the line. I’ve read more trade scenarios since yesterday to fill a few volumes of baseball trade history books..

  22. BK

    So who would say “no” to this:

    – Ramirez (from CLE) and Garcia (CIN) to the Dodgers

    – Lindor (CLE) and Pederson (LAD) to the Reds

    – Lux and Gray (LAD); India, Santillan and Greene (CIN) to the Indians

    P.S. Welcome to the new “Bill”. I’ll flex to “BK” (no relation to MK)!

    • Optimist

      Run that through the trade calculator – I bet your -$100m in the hole on the Reds end. Sure it overvalues MiLBers, but that’s really selling the farm. Also, I expect it undervalues Pederson, but still . . .

      • BK

        I actually did run that through the calculator … it’s fairly balanced on all sides. On the Red’s side it’s with 0.2M (well within any valuation errors).

      • Optimist

        Interesting. I thought the calculator seriously overvalued prospects.

        On the merits, the only player I’d hesitate on is Greene, simply due to the comeback prognosis. Others have noted how this years results will show his forward path.

        As for the Tribe, it would be impressive if they’d go for an all-prospect trade – just Lux’s cup of coffee MLB stats in that list.

        As for the Dodgers, it’s basically Lux for Ramirez which is arguable, but unlikely.

      • BK

        My assumption is that Cleveland only moves Lindor if they are rebuilding and the Dodgers, like the Reds, are looking to compete.

        If you’re the Dodgers, would you prefer to go with Ramirez or Lux? If the season started today, they would likely start Lux at SS and Seager at 3B. I think they would be better going with proven a proven talent; Ramirez is proven and nearly as good as Lindor, but much less costly from a salary perspective. Their outfield is crowded; moving Pederson has a salary advantage for a team over the tax threshold.

        Cleveland would have a solid base of prospects from to accelerate their rebuild. If that’s the direction they’re going, they would be hard pressed to get a better package of talent.

        If the Reds pull off a trade for Lindor or Seager, prepare to cringe on the outflow of prospects. Nobody is giving up elite talent for the players we don’t want. It just won’t happen.

    • Eric T Stauffer

      In answer to your question the Dodgers and the Reds should both say no. You have the Reds literally selling the whole farm. I know the Reds have done a couple of 3 team deals recently but I would not get the Dodgers involved here and the reason why is we don’t get Lindor in the deal. If we talk to Cleveland we get Lindor plain and simple. Senzel, Mahle and Galvis plus one lesser prospect for Lindor. If adding Hinds and Siri gets Mercado as part of the deal, say yes and be done with the off-season.

  23. Mike in Ottawa

    I say no to anything Lindor unless the Reds can work out a long term deal with him. Two seasons is not enough for me to give up a top 3 (in organization) player and probably another 2 top 10-15 player and more. jmo.

  24. JUSTIN

    I would be comfortable giving up Senzel, but that leaves a hole in CF. What would it take to get Marte?

    • Wes

      Tyler Stevenson if reds still have him. Pirates want a catcher.

      It also adds 30 million more to Payroll total w Lindor and marte. Which I assume is much more than reds where expecting to spend. Then everyone gets a raise next year too

  25. sixpack

    o I think we are only a Bat from being close to the top in our division so I would NOT sell the farm for two years and then spend 10 years trying again. I think we have production in the OF if Bell uses the left/right mix which also keeps everyone in the game……. I like everything Williams has done up to now.

    • BK

      I tend to agree … I would try to match up with the Dodgers on one of their two SS with either Senzel or Suarez to fill their need at 3B. This would keep the farm in tact. There are some high floor, but unspectacular CFs available via FA or trade. Backfill the loss with one of them. The net gain will be better this year and the farm remains well stocked.

  26. Alan

    Castillo. It would probably take Castillo to get him.

    Of course, Cleveland also took a relatively weak deal for Kluber, so who knows?

  27. jay johnson

    they are loaded with mediocre outfielders already
    they want infield mlb ready and prospects.
    They love senzel for 2nd base.
    pull a sonny grey and extend lindor(dream) and throw in any minor leaguer except the 2 pitchers and Stephenson.Garcia can be part of the trade now since we have lindor.
    Worry about centerfield later.We would be getting a future hall of famer .Who was the last one of those?
    Go get the guy.PERIOD

  28. Michael B. Green

    Is Delino Deshields still on the coaching staff? If so, including Deshields, Jr., in the Lindor trade (since CLE acquired him from TEX), makes sense, particularly if Senzel or one of the other valued OF’s is part of the trade.

    One would think that Santillan, Mahle or Lodollo is in the deal as well. If CLE needs a SS back, then Galvis is that guy and he has already played with newly-signed Cesar Hernandez.

    There is quite a bit of symmetry (sp) for this deal and it will cost CIN a great deal but Lindor is a star, has post-season experience, and would fit well in CIN (IMO).

    This is the year that CIN contends. No doubt.