It was an interesting night for Hunter Greene. He was scratched from his last start but was ready to go this time around – as expected. On the mound he allowed three home runs in the first three innings. The final home run came with two outs in the 3rd inning. The next batter, who had homered earlier in the game, had a 102 MPH fastball go behind him at roughly thigh height. He took some exception to it, as did the Gwinnett dugout, who began chirping. Stripers catcher Ryan Casteel apparently chirped too much because he was ejected from the game.

At that point the umpires got together halfway up the first base line. After discussing things for a minute they turned around and ejected Hunter Greene from the game. It was impossible to see if this was because Greene said something back to the dugout or if the umpires during their meeting determined the pitch was on purpose – the camera at the time was not on either Greene or the umpires. Once Greene was ejected Louisville manager Pat Kelly stormed onto the field to try and figure out why his pitcher was tossed from the game, and it didn’t last long before he was also ejected. Greene’s final line on the day: 2.2IP, 4H, 4ER, 1BB, 4K.

2nd rounder Andrew Abbott debuts

This past week the Cincinnati Reds have finally had some pitchers that were selected in the 2021 draft making their debuts out in Arizona. With the draft not taking place until mid-July, pitchers had gone 6-8 weeks since they last pitched in games and many teams have taken the approach to either shut them down for the year or bring a few of them along very slowly to get them onto the field. On Tuesday it was time for Cincinnati’s 2nd round pick Andrew Abbott to make his professional debut. The lefty from the University of Virginia tossed a perfect inning with two strikeouts to start the game. That was the only inning he would throw.

39 Responses

  1. RedsGettingBetter

    We could guess Hunter Greene was not recovered at all from the injury so he gave up 3 HRs in less of 3 frames,.. Is it ?

    • MK

      He did same his first AAA performance abd arm was OK. My theory is that when too strong or hyped those fast balls lose their movement and become quite hittable. Saw the same thing in Dayton when Joe Morgan had come to town to watch him. Part of maturing process.

    • Deano

      The front office needs to evaluate there manager he makes some bonehead moves wiyh his bull pen for example lorenzen is starter material and only goes one inning then garrrt who has a 7 era comes in and loses the game

  2. Doc4uk

    Horrible news and update on Hunter. Hopefully it was just a bad night but he does seem to give up home runs in bunches. May need a full year at Louisville . Hopefully Lodolo is closer but it makes it all the more important to extend Miley.

      • Matt O

        And even as cheap as the Reds are, after the way he’s pitched this year you’ve gotta pick it up. Even if Greene and Lodolo aren’t ready for MLB at the start of next year, the current rotation is all under contract (or have the option) for 2022.

      • Ryan

        I’d love to see how you figure the Reds are cheap. Dropped a record amount of cash in FA 18 months ago and ownership probably lost 10’s of millions of dollars last season. Mid-level payroll this season, not sure what more you can ask for. Did Krall leave gaping holes in the roster, and did payroll factor in, sure. People act as though it’s business as usual for small market teams, especially ones without great TV deals, but it’s a whole new landscape.

      • Doug Gray

        The Reds ARE cheap. The owners have watched the value of the franchise quadruple in the 16 years that they have owned it. I don’t care about how they lost some money last year. The value of the franchise has gained roughly $800,000,000 in 16 years.

      • MK

        Doug, Value and cash are bot the same. The value of my home is 10 times more valuable than when I bought it 35 years ago but that has not added one dime to my bank account. In fact the improvements made took cab from the account. If I want to borrow money I could certainly get more than in the past but it would have to pay it back. I’m with Ryan I don’t see them being cheap. Simple macroeconomics.

      • Doug Gray

        And as you mention, you can borrow against that for next to nothing. They are cheap. They should never, for a single second, cry about “losing money”. They have gotten rich beyond wild imagination.

      • Doc

        What percentage of the Reds does Castellini own? I thought it was something like 20%. He is always mentioned in this column as though he owns 100% of the Reds and is chastised by Doug, who appears to have no understanding of or interest in learning about economics, for not borrowing against the full book value of the club, at least some percentage of which is not his money to risk. The same Castellini approved a near record payroll for the Reds a year or so ago but what does that matter?

      • Doug Gray

        Lol. I’m pretty sure that I’ve been about the only person with any sort of “influence” over the last decade to even begin to bring up that Castellini owns a small share (15%) of the Reds, but that it’s more than anyone else owns and is the controlling stake, and that instead of always blaming Castellini we need to put blame on the ownership group as a whole, but go on with your ill-informed rant like you always do when someone talks about the ownership being cheap. I’d venture to bet that you are either related to or know the Castellini or some other insanely rich family and just HATE someone calling them out for it.

        No one is asking the Reds or ownership to borrow a billion freaking dollars to improve the team.

        And who gives a crap about “approving a near record payroll a year or so ago” when the history is littered with the team never spending money? Their “record payroll” didn’t SNIFF the top 10 in the league. So spare me.

    • Doug Gray

      Horrible news? That seems like a bit much. He had a bad night on the mound.

      • Bubba Woo

        100% right about the Castellini’s being cheap. Even if they lose 10-20 million a year, they own an asset that is increasing 15-20% every year in value (apx. 200 mil). Rich people borrow off of the value of their assets all the time. Jeff Bezos doesn’t sell Amazon stock everytime he wants to buy something, he borrows against it at a rate significantly lower than his stock will appreciate.

        If the Castellinis are so cheap that they tank their bullpen by giving away Archie Bradley and Iglesius to save less than 10 mil, they should just go ahead and sell the team to the hundreds of billionaires who would pay them 1.5-2 billion dollars for the Reds.

  3. SultanofSwaff

    Even if the pitch was on purpose, I like it. To me it shows he wasn’t going to take his lumps lying down, something Sonny Gray has done too much of this season. Entirely misplaced? Yes, but it’s easier to dial a kid down than it is to dial one up. He’ll learn and move on from this and be better. All part of the process.

    • Mike in Ottawa

      Not sure I buy the dial up/down comment. Amir Garrett has struggled finding that fine line all season!

  4. Norwood Nate

    Too many ejections occurring in baseball, IMO. Umps have quick triggers nowadays. If a manager goes out after a player is ejected, it’s almost automatic that the manager is ejected as well. There used to be a bit of back and forth, or at least an explanation.given. Now it’s just a quick hook. And, it hasn’t stop anyone from getting hit by pitches. If I read correctly, the Reds set a franchise record on HBP in 2019 and are quickly approaching it in 2021.

  5. LDS

    I sure hope the Reds extend Miley and don’t rush Greene and Lodolo, or Ashcraft for that matter. If they aren’t ready, so be it. And kick Gray in the rear and remind him he’s younger than Miley so pitch like it.

  6. Kindell

    Greene has shown in his prior few starts what he is capable of 22 years old against advanced hitters. He is always going to have to battle the HR ball because people are going to try to sit fastball and it doesn’t take much at that velocity to hit it out. The next step is finding that consistency and I don’t think he is too far off.

    His last start against St. Paul was the best I have seen this season because he was keeping very good hitters off balance. I was hoping that was the start of a dominant finish, but on to the next one.

  7. Chuckles

    The pitch, intentional or not, looked really bad. Throwing 102 behind someone isn’t excusable for any reason or circumstance. It certainly didn’t put me on the “add him to the September roster” bandwagon. Nice that the AAA season has been extended for 10 more games. Leave Greene in Louisville until the Bats season is over.

    • G

      He didn’t hit him!? He sent a message. No one got hurt. I’ll excuse this one.

      • Doug Gray

        If it were on purpose then I’m not excusing anything. Guys simply don’t have the requisite control to “brush them back” without actually risking serious injury.

        Was it one that got away from him? If so, sure, you can excuse that. Very few people know the truth here.

      • Hal

        Not fond of hitting (or just missing) a batter purely based on someone going yard on you. Very fond of reminding a team that you will not stand for your teammates continually getting hit. Big difference between the two and there is value in your teammates knowing you have their back despite what they may say in public.

      • Doug Gray

        I’d far rather someone just charge the mound instead of the pitcher deciding it’s a good idea to go out and throw a pitch at someone to retaliate.

      • Scott C

        A 102 mph fastball should never be thrown intentionally at anyone. That is never excusable. If you don’t want someone to hit a homer throw better pitches, if they hit one off a good pitch then tip your hat to them. Somedays you get the bear and some days the bear gets you. No excuse to throw at someone period. These are not the days of Ty Cobb and Walter Johnson. At times a pitch gets away from a pitcher, that is excusable I hope that Hunter was just having a bad night.

  8. Bubba Woo

    Greene will be fine. Everybody has games when they can’t target their fastball. Greene is still very young. Most pitchers his age are still in A-ball. With the depth of starters the Reds have, you can wait until he completely dominates in AAA to bring him up.

  9. amdg

    Greene, who just turned 22, gave up HR’s to a pair of 27 year olds, and a 33 year old, who have tons of minor league experience.

    Greene has pitched all of 17 games above low A ball. So he certainly warrants the benefit of doubt before determining he can’t get guys out.

    Even with that game, he still owns a 3.00 ERA in his last 6 games with 41K’s over 30 IP’s.

    • VegasRed

      Doug I 100% agree with you and your righteous criticism of bobby/owner group! You are the only voice in Cincy media to tell it like it is. So keep it up.

      Every fan also knows bobby is the front man for this group of owners. And they are the worst type of owners in that they are not in it to win it. All they care about is the money!

      And they did sign some free agents in 2020 but over YEARS to pay out, after never signing much of anyone to build around Joey for over 5 years of his prime. They just pocketed the money for season after season.

      Are they better than the Pittsburgh Group? Maybe, but how is that anything to brag about?

      Ryan and his ilk are either plants or their eyes are painted on.

      This is the best team since the 2010-12 versions. But any fan on this board can see the flaws in this owner group. Because this team with a little love from the owner could have been a playoff type team.

      Even with the payroll as is, my biggest complaint is who runs the club. On the field and front office. Bobby has never hired top notch baseball FO or MGR! Someone like Stearns in Mil.

      Krall may be ok, who knows. But who did he learn from—jockety? Overrated much?

      The fans deserve better and Bobby promised better, much much better. Championship baseball!

      He’s making the entire owner group look like liars.

      • Mark

        https://www.mlb.com/news/jose-barrero-taking-outfield-reps-for-reds

        It is sickening to continue to see these poor management decisions made by the Reds Hierarchy. You make a $10,000,000 dollar investment in Jose Barrero because your scouts who signed him say he is a true SS in the Manny Machado, Alex Rodriguez mode despite him never playing SS playing for the Cuban National traveling team. Now the people in charge of the ML product want to teach him a new position at the ML level. Put the kid in at SS everyday and see if he is the SS of the future if not find another position for him. If you play him at a position he is not used to he might get hurt and you will never know what could have been. Longer throws, different arm action, communication on flyballs. The people doing this should be fired. They have been doing this for years. Nick Senzel comes to mind. Signed as 2nd overall pick in the draft and moved to CF. How has that worked out with him staying healthy diving for balls in CF , shoulder injuries, many other injuries. He never played CF in college. Senzel was a special talent asked to play a position he was not accustomed to. Chapman should have been a Starting pitcher, Raisel Iglesias also should have been a starting pitcher. His first three ML starts are a Reds record recording 10 K’s in each of his 1st 3 starts.

        If there is something Bob Castellini is not paying attention to are these personnel decisions that are being made with his high Dollar amateur acquisitions. A true 5 Tool everyday ML SS is the most difficult player to acquire and develop at the amateur level. THE REDS just promoted the one guy they have signed since Barry Larkin and they want to teach him a new position in the ML. THEY SHOULD ALL BE FIRED.

      • RojoB

        With the exception that they tried Iglesias at starter and his shoulder could not hold up

  10. sixpack

    I really do not understand this lack of understanding on value of an asset. If you borrow against an assets value you MUST pay it back with interest or loss that asset.
    So a smart person does not borrow unless they have the cash flow to make the payments.

    • HoosierBadger

      Hmmm. The idea that owners of an MLB franchise worth billions and appreciating at a generous rate of return somehow deserve empathy because they don’t have those billions in cash is sort of ludicrous to me. The value of the franchise has been and likely will continue to appreciate at a robust rate. That’s one benefit of having essentially a monopoly, a rate of return that is much higher than what you could get in the market. I’d prefer having the franchise than the cash. Of course, that is not to say I wouldn’t be very happy either way.

      The Reds owners are cheap. The perverse reality is that they do not have to improve the quality of the team to enjoy a huge return on their investment. The fans are shortchanged. It is only fair to call the owners out for their parsimonious ways. Thanks, Doug, for having the courage to do that.

    • Tom

      The point is, once you’re super rich, doing next to nothing can and often does result in massive wealth accumulation. Along the way you borrow off your assets at low interest rates while paying almost nothing in taxes.

      Being a sports franchise owner is a pretty safe investment. Being that the Castellini’s only own like 20%, there are 80% of other Reds owners almost no one knows about that kind of do nothing and reap the enormous financial rewards. Maybe their the cheap ones, too. Chances are they’re jet setting, enacting some other (several) financial schemes as well and the Reds are a little umbrella in their drink.

      Boo hoo.
      https://www.financialsamurai.com/never-sell-assets-and-pay-less-in-taxes-like-billionaires/

      That said, if they’re going to play poor, then act and react that way by selling high and buying low.

      This next CBA could fix some of the parity issues and reset this whole conversation.